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From: JJ <jj4public@vfemail.net>
Newsgroups: alt.msdos.batch.nt,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,microsoft.public.windowsx p.help_and_support
Subject: [OT] Yet another Microsoft documentation inconsistency
Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2016 02:22:58 +0700
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These two TechNet pages describes the VERIFY command of CMD.EXE, but one of them lies.

<https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb491029.aspx>

<https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc754978.aspx>
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From: "R.Wieser" <address@not.available>
Newsgroups: alt.msdos.batch.nt,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,microsoft.public.windowsx p.help_and_support
References: <1wfvvff87ktcc$.21sn6pqzqw5$.dlg@40tude.net>
Subject: Re: [OT] Yet another Microsoft documentation inconsistency
Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2016 09:20:49 +0200
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JJ,

These two TechNet pages describes the VERIFY command of
CMD.EXE, but one of them lies.

Both can be considered to be true: The one one tells you the command exists
and what the setting it gouverns its *ment* for, the other one tells you the setting is ignored. :-)

But yes, I would, from the larger description, also assume that the setting would have its described effect. I would call it "lying by omission",
though that would not hold in court, as both pieces are clearly available
(as you've shown). :-\

There remains a question though: does the OS now never, or always check if a write-action has succeeded (rather important when writing to a medium like a floppy).

Regards,
Rudy Wieser


-- Origional message:
JJ <jj4public@vfemail.net> schreef in berichtnieuws 1wfvvff87ktcc$.21sn6pqzqw5$.dlg@40tude.net...

These two TechNet pages describes the VERIFY command of CMD.EXE, but one

of

them lies.

<https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb491029.aspx>

<https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc754978.aspx>

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From: JJ <jj4public@vfemail.net>
Newsgroups: alt.msdos.batch.nt,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,microsoft.public.windowsx p.help_and_support
Subject: Re: [OT] Yet another Microsoft documentation inconsistency
Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2016 18:27:46 +0700
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On Sun, 12 Jun 2016 09:20:49 +0200, R.Wieser wrote:

Both can be considered to be true: The one one tells you the command exists and what the setting it gouverns its *ment* for, the other one tells you the setting is ignored. :-)

But the conflict remains. One states that it's ignored in Windows XP, while
the other one doesn't. The one that states it's ignored... makes it look
that the command may actually exist on Windows 2000/NT4, kaput on Windows
XP, then magically pop ups back in Vista and later.

There remains a question though: does the OS now never, or always check if a write-action has succeeded (rather important when writing to a medium like a floppy).

On WinNT, written data aren't verified. All disk write failures are hardware failures. I've checked all disk related device drivers and there's no
reference to string "verify" except 3 kernel I/O functions which aren't
related to disk-write verify. The File API doesn't seem to provide any
support for it too - *including* transaction-enabled file operations
(ouch!).

Hopefully, nowadays storage ECCs are reliable enough.
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From: "R.Wieser" <address@not.available>
Newsgroups: alt.msdos.batch.nt,microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,microsoft.public.windowsx p.help_and_support
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Subject: Re: [OT] Yet another Microsoft documentation inconsistency
Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2016 14:02:36 +0200
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JJ,

One states that it's ignored in Windows XP, while the other
one doesn't.

The latter one is what I ment by my "lying by ommision" remark: It makes you *assume* that the setting it gouverns has an(y) effect, while it actually doesn't.

makes it look that the command may actually exist on Windows
2000/NT4, kaput on Windows XP, then magically pop ups back
in Vista and later.

Pretty much, yes.

... though more "is ignored on OS ***" webpages might be floating around
there ...

(personally I get the feeling the setting is ignored on all of them)

On WinNT, written data aren't verified. All disk write failures are
hardware failures.

....

Hopefully, nowadays storage ECCs are reliable enough.

I can imagine that for the harddrives (which nowerdays are rather smart and have error checking, repairing and bad-sector management build in), but for (something like) a floppy ? Not so much ... And those floppies where, when
XP was young, still in use.

Regards,
Rudy Wieser


-- Origional message:
JJ <jj4public@vfemail.net> schreef in berichtnieuws 2mbl0mksq4id$.17gsy0z9rcgth$.dlg@40tude.net...

On Sun, 12 Jun 2016 09:20:49 +0200, R.Wieser wrote:

Both can be considered to be true: The one one tells you the command

exists

and what the setting it gouverns its *ment* for, the other one tells you

the

setting is ignored. :-)

But the conflict remains. One states that it's ignored in Windows XP,

while

the other one doesn't. The one that states it's ignored... makes it look
that the command may actually exist on Windows 2000/NT4, kaput on Windows
XP, then magically pop ups back in Vista and later.

There remains a question though: does the OS now never, or always check

if a

write-action has succeeded (rather important when writing to a medium

like a

floppy).

On WinNT, written data aren't verified. All disk write failures are

hardware

failures. I've checked all disk related device drivers and there's no reference to string "verify" except 3 kernel I/O functions which aren't related to disk-write verify. The File API doesn't seem to provide any support for it too - *including* transaction-enabled file operations
(ouch!).

Hopefully, nowadays storage ECCs are reliable enough.

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Subject: Re: [OT] Yet another Microsoft documentation inconsistency
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On 12/06/2016 05:22, JJ wrote:

These two TechNet pages describes the VERIFY command of CMD.EXE, but one of them lies.

<https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb491029.aspx>

This one is right. Back in MSDOS days we knew that verify didn't actually test that the data was written correctly either. In Batpower forum on
Fidonet there was discussion of batch files and command.com galore.

A MUF V1.7 file exists from Mr Bat Lang in that forum and explaining the Microsoft Undocumented Features.

It was great fun then too.

<https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc754978.aspx>

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